Welcome to episode 28 of The UnSunday Show. At its core, The UnSunday Show is a podcast about the system we call church. To a very large extent, this system has come to us via church history, religious tradition, and theological distinction, not from the New Testament. Mike talks about that system we’ve inherited in this episode. He also makes an exciting announcement about the future of The UnSunday Show. Push Play and join the conversation.
Welcome to episode 18 of The UnSunday Show. This episode is a conversation I had earlier today with my friend, Bonnie Petroschuk about her recent journey out of the institutional church and into Ekklesia. In her own words, Bonnie was “Mrs. Church” and was shocked by her own journey as she began to see and understand the significant differences between the two and realized she could no longer stay in the institutional system. I think you’ll be encouraged by Bonnie’s story and parts of it will be like your own.
You’ll find Bonnie’s blog at: http://goodnewsofgodsgrace.blogspot.com/
We also talked about:
- The Growing in Grace Podcast
- Clash of the Covenants: Escaping Religious Bondage Through the Grace Guarantee, by Michael C. Kapler
Welcome to episode 15 of The UnSunday Show. In this episode I continue my interaction with Jon Zens’ book, A Church Building Every 1/2 Mile: What Makes American Christianity Tick? as I look closer at the top-down authority structure of the clergy/laity system. In my opinion, this system is not neutral but adds an intentional, built-in layer of division within the body of Christ. The pastor-centric, top-down clergy/laity systems in most institutional churches is a product of church history. There is no New Testament warrant for its existence. In fact, the New Testament clearly mitigates against it.
The result of 2,000+ years of the clergy/laity system is that we can’t function apart from the pastor. The pastor is central to the extent that the identity of the entire local church is wrapped up in the person of the pastor in charge and if he or she fails to show up on a Sunday unannounced, we don’t know what to do. We even assign ownership of our local churches to the one pastor in charge. This expresses itself in phrases like, “I go to pastor John’s church” or “Pastor Jim started a new church.” This system of complete dependence on one person was first introduced by Ignatius of Antioch in the early 2nd century when he said,
“Let no one do anything in the church apart from the bishop. Holy communion is valid when celebrated by the bishop or someone the bishop authorizes. Where the bishop is present, there let the congregation gather, just as where Jesus Christ is, there is the church.”
Here are some links related to this episode:
- Rethinking Religion, Part 3: The Clergy/Laity Distinction
- A Church Building Every 1/2 Mile: What Makes American Christianity Tick? – by Jon Zens
Welcome to episode 14 of the UnSunday Show! In this episode, I continue my interaction with Jon Zens’ book entitled, A Church Building Every 1/2 Mile: What Makes American Christianity Tick? In Section 5 of the book, which is called Why Has Church Become So One-Part Driven?, Zens shares the following quote from David L. McKenna,
“[The pastor] is like the cerebellum, the center for communicating messages, coordinating functions, and conducting responses between the head and body…. The pastor is not only the authoritative communicator of the truth from the Head to the Body, but he is also the accurate communicator of the needs from the Body to the Head.”
Later in the chapter he quotes C. Peter Wagner as saying,
“The army has only one Commander-in-Chief, Jesus Christ. The local church is like a company with one company commander, the pastor, who gets his orders from the Commander-in-Chief. The company commander has lieutenants and sergeants under him for consultation and implementation, but the final responsibility for decisions is that of the company commander, and he must answer to the Commander-in-Chief… The pastor has the power in a growing church… The pastor of a growing church may appear to outsiders as a dictator. But to the people of the church, his decisions are their decisions.”
Let’s talk about it!
Zen’s book and my blogs mentioned in this episode:
- A Church Building Every 1/2 Mile: What Makes American Christianity Tick? (I recommend this book!)
- Why Is There A Pulpit?
- The Pastor-Driven Church